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I am re-rigging 1877 and one of our club members suggests using 3/4 mm flexible wire (like thicker jib halyard) for the two shrouds. Inadvertantly supplied for his D18, it has apparently lasted a lot longer than the stiffer standard wire that others have been using because, he says, it is better able to accept the flexing at the hounds end when the mast swivels. Sounds logical enough. Is this "legal" and does anybody have a view or any experience on this subject? Incidentally, how do you shorten the RYO tiller extension without spoiling the nice rubber grip at the outer end or the nicely swaged joint at the inner end? Please tell!
Hi Mark
I have just gone through this exercise since buying a new D15 Barcelona, which is now apparently supplied as standard with a D18 tiller extension, and is presumably the same length you would use if sprinting.
If you grip the black plastic covering tightly and push, it should slide down the aluminium tube . This will expose 1 rivet head holding the white end stop in place.
Now cut the tube to the appropriate length which then leaves you with a short piece of tube with the end stop .
Put this in a vice if you can and drill out the rivet.
Then you will probably need a dowel to fit inside the tube so you can knock the end cap out without damage ( rather than trying to pull it out ).
Then simply re-drill a new hole in the tiller extension, and re-rivet or fit a self-tapper to hold the end cap in place again.
Finally, push back the black outer gripper up to the white end stop. which then covers the rivet as before . GOT IT ?
Cheers Paul Smith
Paul Smith doesn't sprint. I've not come across a sprinter who uses a standard Dart 18 tiller extension - I don't think it is long enough. (if you bear in mind it's not long enough for a Dart 18, and a Dart 18 is only 3 inches wider from the centre line than a Dart 15, this is not surprising).
I use a slightly shortened Dart 18 Single Handed Tiller Extension.
If you look through the Chat pages you'll find some helpful advice from Bob Carter on the matter.
I too have recently bought the RYO tiller ext. from SSM. It is extremely well made and the grip and swaged ends are really nice (and cheaper than the Dart 18 Single handed tiller alternative).
However, its very log. I have not done it yet, but I think that I will cut the joint end and put a new rubber flex joint on it (and lose the swivel feature). Its a shame but I'm not sure that trying to remove and replace the grip will work.
Has anyone else tried with this tiller (RYO from Steve Sawford Marine)????
Just a quick reminder - click on "Tips" on the side menu, then "Forum Quotes" and you'll find a collection of the past comments on sprint tiller extensions.
One of my projects for this year is to get a search facility working on the chat pages, which should be useful.
Now I am confused - not that I was discussing tiller extension lengths, and do not profess to be an expert on them, only how to cut the standard one down , but how come a std Dart 18 extension is not even long enough for a Dart 18 ? Illogical Mr. Spok ! I have cut approximately 8 inches off, which means that it has 5 more useable inches (those were the days!) when on a Dart 18 if it's only 3 inches wider than a Dart 15 . Also the reference to using a 'slightly shorter' extension - are there no specific rules pertaining to legal useable lengths in our '1 design class' ??
Yours curiously Paul Smith
Hi Paul,
I am concerned that the Laser Centre are selling out of class rules tillers (i.e. Dart 18 ones) with the new boats.
This is not on with a one design boat. I intend to take it up with Dave Graham.
Thye other guys in this chat item are discussing big long tiller extensions sold by Steve Sawford to use when Sprinting.
Cheers
Bob
The length of the Standard Dart 18 Tiller extension was presumably chosen so as to be usable by a Dart 18 Helm who leaves trapezing to the crew. It has to be 3 inches longer than a Dart 15 standard tiller extension, because of the extra 6 inch width of the D18, and then a bit more because the helm may have to be further up the bigger trampoline to trim the D18 than would be the case on a D15.
Neither of the standard tiller extensions is anything like long enough to use satisfactorily when out on a trapeze wire on either Dart. Hence a specific longer tiller extension is available for those who sail D18s single handed (and this is "in class" for a single handed D18 - I don't know or care if it is in class for a crewed D18 where the helm wants to trapeze - this is unusual, but not rare).
The D15 rules are "flexible" in comparison with the D18. Sprinters use any of a number of different tiller extensions which are long enough.
I endorse Bob's comments about Laser Centre providing "out of class" parts on new Dart 15s without raising the issue with the Dart 15 Class Association. They've done it before with sails, later with the trampoline tubes, and apparently now with tiller extensions.
I suggest that in future any orders for new Dart 15s might usefully be expressed in such a way that it is clear that the boat ordered is to conform with Dart 15 Class Rules. This would ensure that the purchaser would have clear legal right of redress in the event of further errors or omissions by Laser Centre, including all expenses incurred in getting things put right. I'm not a lawyer, so getting the words right isn't my expertise.
The Dart 18 tiller has a tube length of 1854mm and the Dart 15 should have a tube length of 1680mm - think. I keep meaning to measure mine, but it is in tha sailbag @ Grafham
Cheers
Bob
The tiller that came with my Millennium boat was also a Dart 18 one, which at the time I thought was a mistake. I wrote and complained to the Laser Centre, but it was easier to cut the long one down - using a similar technique to Paul Smith. I cut 17.5 mm off the tube length. I have re-raised the issue with them and the debate has started.
Cheers
Bob
P.S. I take the end off all my tillers and put 2 extra 'rubber' grips (D40254) on them. They are only a few pounds each and it means that you don't have to hold the slippery aluminium section. If you do this it helps if you immerse the new grips in a bucket of hot water and then put them on quickly!
George sailed a whole race at Instow with one of my old Sprint Tillers which was broken in the middle and only held together by one of the 'rubber' grips which spanned the break.
PPS Many of us Sprinters use a special Dart 18 single handed tiller (for trapezing) also cut down in a similar way - which I think is where the confusion (above) has arisen.
I have just measured the Dart18 tiller that I received from laser it measures 2670mm so what length do I have to cut off to be able to trapeeze with it and keep within Class Rules.
Thanks
Chris
